…So here’s an interesting point.
This is Page Smith. He was in the history department in Santa Cruz. You went to
Santa Cruz. Do you remember Page Smith? Well, he was one of the original guys.
He kind of left in disgust when they started going more conventional. His wife
I made the first head of the arts council and I got to know Page Smith.
This guy wrote a book, he’s the
founding provost of UC Santa Cruz. He was there with Paul Lee. All these
characters. And Bateson was there. Anyway, he writes a book very critical of
higher education and he’s a humanist …
William James wrote an essay
called the Moral Equivalent of War. He said men get really get their courage in
war, it brings out the best in people. But it’s very costly. We need the moral
equivalent of war.
(Note: On Page Smith and William James, see http://www.smithtrust.com/htmlpages/Page.html. On Bateson, see http://www.indiana.edu/~wanthro/theory_pages/Bateson.htm. On Paul Lee, see http://ecotopia.org/about/paul-lee-cv/.)
When (President) Roosevelt
started the CCC (Civilian Conservation Corps, a Depression jobs project), this
Harvard guy, I won’t mention his name here, had a thing called Camp William
James which was one of the CCC camps and the notion was the CCC was going to be
that initiation where people go into a camp, work on trails, build things, and
that builds the kind of character and comradery that you can get in war.
So, that’s something that
inspired me when I created the California Conservation Corps. And even now as
we close down the fire camps, can we find more money and get more kids going
off to these fire camps?
The CCC used to have, like, 27 camps.
Now they have like 4 or 5. And my whole idea was to get people out of the city.
I know we’ve got LA and San Francisco, but I wanted to get them out of the city
into some rural backwater, working on clearing streams and trails – whatever.
And I’m still doing that.
So, you have CCC, we have an idea
William James, you have an idea and there’s a continuity there. Same with the
university. What’s the university all
about? We’re always talking about tuition and about cutting but there’s a lot
of question there on what’s going on at the university.
And people talk about especially
at Cal State – it’s (about) workforce. We’re creating people for the workforce.
In other words, you’re a cog and I’m putting you in a machine and the machine’s
going to run better because we have better cogs.
Well, there’s idea that the
university is not about training, it’s about opening your mind. That’s what he
talks about.
Well, how can I apply that? Well,
maybe I can appoint certain people. I haven’t appointed anyone to the regents
yet. Well, who should I appoint? That’s a good question. What are they going to
do?
I’ve appointed some people to the
Cal State and I’ve appointed some interesting people on the state board and I’m
looking, but what impact does that make? If you want to make change, can the
state board make an impact? Can the Cal State make an impact? Things are very
conservative in how they run.
Before when I used to go to the regents, I’d go armed and I was
attacking. But it’s totally marginal. You can’t influence ... So now it takes
more time, you’ve got to be more subtle, you need more allies. You need a
long-term game plan.
So, I have a longer term game
plan than I had 30 years ago, even though I’ve got less time because I’m 74,
I’m not 36. I’m thinking through how I can influence or move in a direction
that take the more creative and more productive of those values that I think
are important. And those values with the university are truth, beauty …
I also know these boards are not affected by one or two people, so
there’s no rush. There are a lot of people I know. Blum I know, the lady who’s
the president, she was the president of one of the movie studios. They’ve got
people there.
I’ve put in some people on Cal
State that I know. I looked for people. I appointed a guy that was in the
Jesuits with me. Just like on the OMI board I appointed three people who I went
to high school with.
(Oakland Military Institute:
Presumably Brown is talking about the period when he was mayor of Oakland. See http://oakmil.org/domain/3.)
Now, I know I can’t just take my
old friends from the '50s and put them in positions. Actually, there’s two
people who I knew from the seminary who left and went into the CIA. And I put
one of them on OMI and I put one of them on Cal State.
But I’m looking for different …
But I know that three appointments can’t make (a difference). It really takes
ten. But by the time you get to ten, and you listen to this group and that
group, and I gotta take care of that and you have diversity and this influence
person – by the time you get your ten people, they’re so different that you
have no impact anyway.
So this idea that you can
influence by your appointees, you have to take care of all your various
constituencies and then you end up replicating what is. And that’s why things
don’t change very much.
Now, I am more strategic now
since I understand this better and I’m patiently looking for openings. I know
that I don’t just want change for the sake of change because that’s
superficial.
If you want to do something that you know is good but is different, the
last place you’re going to get it done is UC. The second to last place you’re going to get it done is Cal State. And
the place more likely would be the community colleges, because they’re more
flexible.
So, if you say, what’s the role
of online learning? It’s pretty interesting stuff. I don’t say it’s a total
solution in any sense but it could play a role in making sure every kid could
get out in four years if they want. Could the state actually say we will make
sure you have an opportunity to do only four years or could we have a different
kind of degree? I’m looking at that.
And what would be the role of
community colleges, what would be the role of state colleges? Could they all
work and interact? OK, I can’t figure all that out. I can’t think of
everything. …
The full interview is at http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/california-politics/2012/09/jerry-brown-interview.html. The exact date of the interview is not specified.
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